Can i do some ball-less timing?

[flipper]

I'm trying to get my timing right w/ a timing light but for the life o me, i can't see that stupid little bb-sized ball i'm supposed to see. i've even had a pal with better eyes come over and he can't find it either. okay ... but what about this?

couldn't i do the same thing with the timing marks on the pulley up front? here's what i'm thinking. i've got a 76 w/ weber carbs and crane ignition, if it makes a difference. anyway, my understanding is that the bb ball is set at 25 degrees BTDC. Couldn't I set my digital timing light to 25 degrees BTDC, set the car to idle at 1,400 rpm, and shoot the light at the up-front pulley, start jimmying w/ the dizzy, and set my timing that way?

i guess it wouldn't be as accurate, but given i can't see the ball at all, might it not be the next best thing?

or is my logic totally fudged?

tia, as usual!

[M3M3]

yes, you can. i do that regularly as a double check.

have you tried highlighting the ball on the flywheel? unbend a metal coat hanger. with engine running, very slowly lower the sharp end into the fly timing hole. it will catch the timing ball since it sticks up. this will scratch the crud off and make it shiny...easier to see. i don't suggest using andy thing solid like a screw driver for this job. coat hangers are soft enough to bend.

i assume with your digital light you are pointing it at the hole and adding/subtracting timing with it looking for the ball in case the timing is way off from 24deg stock.

[flipper]

thanks.

main problem with the bb is i can't get my bulbous head far enough over the hole to see down inside. plus i don't know what i'm looking for. plus i'm sweating bullets and my eyes are stinging with salt water.

doing it by the pulley -- am i right in saying to set the light to a positive 25 degrees?

thanks again.

[tjones02]

Yes you can, it works just fine to set the timing that way... though I usually hold the RPMs up with my third hand. :b...

You can also highlight the ball ant OT marks on the flywheel like this... we JUST talked about it last week......

http://www.bmw2002faq.com/component/option,com_forum/Itemid,57/page,viewtopic/t,344693

HTH

[flipper]

thanks. i missed that thread from last week, but i don't know how much help it is anyway, since i can't get my head angled right to see down the hole. and, yes, i am standing on the driver's side!

if the other way works just as well and is so much easier and more convenient, why isn't everybody doing it that way anyhow?

[Guest Anonymous]

I've used the eraser end of a pencil in the hole to clean up the ball and make it bright and shiny - if you very slowly move the distributor while the car is running, near the point that maximizes the RPMs, the ball will appear.

[MarkB]

If the ball wasn't there everyone would be timing with the pulley. I've always stood on the passenger side, perhaps a little stool. the ball is cool, cause you can have your left hand on the dizzy and turn it slightly while your watching the ball line up to the edge. It is possible someone previously installed the flywheel so that the ball is nowhere where the correct timing is.

I'd time it with the pulley and then try to locate the ball so you can verify it is in the timing location. BTW i've seen two pulley pointers, an actual pointer form the timing cover, and a casted timing mark on the cover, which sticks out like 1/4 inch.

[nbcbird]

A big problem with seeing the timing ball is that you don't have a direct view thru to the bell housing because the bodywork surrounding the front of the heater obstructs your view. How many of you have drilled a hole (3/8" to 1/2 ") in the sheet metal just below the center hood latch assembly? This gives you a direct view into the timing hole rather than an oblique one to the front.

This is a very old 2002 fix. I can post a picture if that would help.--Jim

[flipper]

post a picture -- that'd be great.

meanwhile, i went ahead and set the timing using the front pulley. seemed to work ok. but i still can't see the ball in the wee window...

anyway, thanks, all, for your help!

[nbristow01]

You can also time from underneath the car in front. On some timing cain covers there is an indicator on the bottom of the lower one. Also marks on the flywheel. My mechanic could never see the ball so it timed oit 38 degrees total advance. Then one day I was on the driver side and SAW THE BALLLLL. And guess what..his 38 deg total advance from underneath was freaknig dead on with the timing ball

[TobyB]

check your pulley marks, though- they aren't all tdc.

I have a variety of pulleys, and they vary from no marks

to lots... and then you need a decoder ring!

heh

t

ps, and no, if you're Jonny, you CANNOT time without balls...