2 years later...another guibo ready for replacement

[bnam]

I understand your point. The reason I am concerned that the gap may have narrowed...

Wile the shift shaft position is fixed vs. outputshaft/guibo etc, it has just a tad of play. This shaft is cantilevered out and connected to the shifter thru the linkage. While pushing up on the tranny, the shifter does not move at all, so the linkage between the shifter and shifter rod on the tranny has just a little bit more downward pressure on the cantilevered end and IF there is play on the shift rod, it could get just a bit closer.

The shift rod on my car has a large gouge on the shifter rod (in line with the flange/guibo location -- not sure if there perhaps was a 6 bolt guibo on before. But even with the 8bolt, there is not more thana few mm of gap.

Sorry for hijack -- will stop. My posting was to confirm that the U bracket requires a couple of washer to push the tranny back up per the 80mm spec.

I've got it back on now. I am concerned that pushing it up has narrowed the gap a bit between the shift linkage shaft and the guibo.

Byas

folks...you can push up the tranny as far as you want and YOU WILL NEVER CHANGE THE GAP BETWEEN THE SHIFT LINKAGE SHAFT AND THE GUIBO! i see this comment alot. think about it. the shift linkage shaft is part of the tranny. so is the guibo. they aint gonna get closer together unless you crush the entire transmission or bend the linkage shaft.

[c.d.iesel]

I wouldn't blame a JURID coupling - they last 100 years on any

Mercedes-Benz !

[jgerock]

Car is now back on the ground with grin-inducing test drive today (70+ degrees F!).

Stock 4-speed tranny mount required more modifications to clear the exhaust.

With assistance from mlytle yesterday, we got the tranny/guibo/DS/center support bearing alignment so there is equal spacing at the guibo. This required several trial and error fitments along with washers under the CSB and tranny mount.

It is a tight fit between the exhaust pipe/flange and floor/tranny mount.

Backing up a bit.. Jim K. my output shaft does sit higher than the trans housing.

You've got to be creative when trying to install small hardware in and outside the car by yourself.

Final tightening was done using Vice-grip pliers on the inside nuts while I used an allen wrench below (thanks for the tip Marshall).

Buttoned it up this morning. Lowered the car, put away the tools then started it up... Ting, ting, ting noise from engine bay. Fan was hitting the radiator top tank since we tipped the engine/trans combination higher than before. Some adjustments to the radiator mounting flanges were done and it now just barely clears.

Went for a test drive after getting some good Shell gasoline. No thumping noises and no vibrations. I'm willing to bet most of the issues were with the driveshaft mis-alignment, but the solid mounting of the tranny should have helped my situation. My driveshaft is 3/16" too short. The differential is pushed all the way forward. Not 100% sure, but I thought I ordered a 59 3/4" OAL DS and got one that was 59 9/16". My mistake for not double-checking what was shipped to me. I'll keep a close eye on this guibo.

[M3M3]

hmmm, you did order at 59 3/4 ds here

http://www.bmw2002faq.com/component/option,com_forum/Itemid,57/page,viewtopic/p,717993/#717993

funny you got a 59 9/16...that is what i had ordered for mine 6 months earlier. did the just make another one like mine?

[Kidasters]

Wow Jim - sounds like quite the ordeal.

Are you worried at all about the engine moving around under hard braking and tagging the radiator? Have you thought about upgrading your motor mounts?

Just wondering.

Ken

[jgerock]

Wow Jim - sounds like quite the ordeal.

Are you worried at all about the engine moving around under hard braking and tagging the radiator? Have you thought about upgrading your motor mounts?

Just wondering.

Ken

Not really an ordeal.. just a steep learning curve caused mainly by me failing to measure the DS after delivery. The other factor was that I swapped my original diff for another one, possibly making my original measurements incorrect. I should try to do (1) major thing at a time.

My limiting strap on the passenger side motor mount is touching the mount.

[ifayeoh]

Quite the learning experience i would say, sounds like you were able to get DS aligned just right. Sweet.

A key learning would be that, some how the motor tilted to help get the guibo spacing correct. Maintaining the Motor level or in place during this setup is Key as well, to avoid fan or even the Distributor from hitting. Which would suggest that the new mounts are not in the same plane as the old ones and should be lower. May also want to remember that with the engine tilted the shifter plate has to sit closer to the top of tunnel right? did you notice shifter height change in cab?

Happy Motoring!

Frank

[jimk]

Jim,

Two items,

1. On high rpm when the fan is pulling strongly on the air, the blades will flex forward. Some allowance is needed.

2. Given the washers to lower the center bearing, do you have an angle between the front and rear shafts on the DS? If so how much?

I am of the opinion that the DS sections do not lie in a straight line with the 5spd conversion. To have the front section in alignment with the crank/trans shaft CLs, the motor sits too high, mine does. I've loosened all the mounts and there isn't enough hole to bolt tolerance to get it all straight. The trans can't be jacked up more w/o banging on the tunnel. So I adhered to the std universal joint rule to have the rear joint to DS with the opposite angle to negate the cycling velocity phenonomen by a rear subframe adjustment.

[M3M3]

yep. mine is same way. almost identical to jims. slight angle in ds at u-joint because you can't get the tranny high enough. the tranny tunnel slopes down on top. the longer 5spd tranny hits the top of the tunnel further back than a 4spd preventing the ability to get it high enough to get ds straight. have to compensate by shimming the cb down about 3 washers.

i even beat on the top of my tranny tunnel to attempt to get more room. didn't hiti it hard enough....

[jgerock]

I appreciate the assistance (both here and off line).

During this bracket installation, I tried to keep the driveshaft sections in the same plane by using a piece of 2x4 lumber with (3) screws sticking out at the same lengths.

If I were to keep the two sections parallel to each other (and no washers used at the CSB), there is an unequal gap between the guibo and driveshaft yoke (tighter at top, looser at bottom). We shimmed up the tranny with three thin fender washers to get the same gap all around. I do not recall, but I think we are at the prescribed 80mm measurement from the framerails to the tranny mount (using the washers). Before the washers were inserted, I measured approx. 3".

The bolt on mounts are even with the stock mounts.

Even with the stock 4-speed, I had tight clearance between the fan and radiator. As Mike Pugh questioned yesterday, maybe I have an incorrect fan or water pump on the car (both installed by a PO).

[Jeffrey Kok]

I've read most of the article but the last remark worries me.

you say you placed the tranny mounts 80-mm but that is for a close ratio gearbox the e21 gearbox is just a little longer witch explains why there is no clearance at the front and why you used washers, there shouldn't be any washers.

I have a close ratio in my touring and a e21 5 speed in the baur, they are not the same length

[jgerock]

I've read most of the article but the last remark worries me.

you say you placed the tranny mounts 80-mm but that is for a close ratio gearbox the e21 gearbox is just a little longer witch explains why there is no clearance at the front and why you used washers, there shouldn't be any washers.

I have a close ratio in my touring and a e21 5 speed in the baur, they are not the same length

Thanks Jeffrey. The 80mm specification from the Blue book most likely only does apply to the CR 5-speed.. but there are many folks here who seem to use this for the E21 unit. Since the transmission is longer and the engine is tilted front to back anyway, I would think the new brackets would need to be lower than the stock ones.

Going back over my situation, if I remove the (3) washers to lower the transmission to rest on the horizontal bracket, then the guibo will not contact the driveshaft yoke evenly. Not sure why my car is so far off.

[bnam]

The difference in length between the CR and OD gearboxes is 11mm. Assuming the slope of the gearbox is 10degrees (could be less than that), the difference in ht is less than 2mm (1.9mm). So perhaps it needs 1 washer less. So the 80mm metric is probably 78 or 79 instead.

B

[M3M3]

bottom line is that cr or e21, the tranny is irrelevant. the end state must be a guibo that is square to the end of the driveshaft. whether that is with a bracket at 60mm, 70mm, 78mm or 80mm does not matter. that measurement is always suspect anyway as it it referenced to the frame rails, which have been used for jacking for 35years and are probably not in factory location anymore.

in this case and with several of my installs, the tranny cannot be raised high enough to make that alignment happen due to the back of the tranny hitting the top of the tunnel. once tranny is "topped out" against the tunnel, the only easy way to make the guibo square is to lower the CB. this results in a kink in the DS at the u-joint.

well, not the only way....can alway remove the tranny and beat the top of the tranny tunnel into submission, which i did to some extent the last time. or lower the engine...not practical.

[bnam]

How do you check whether the DS is square to output flange? I'd like to check on mine. I did raise the tranny to ~80mm. I can't say whether that caused the DS to not be square -- I may not have looked closely enough. My CB has no washers lowering it.

Byas