Alpina and Borrani (CMR) 13” Steel Rims

[jp5Touring]

Why do I feel like the sale will fall through.  Couple of guys got real caught up in it.

[Lorin]

WTF

 

[BritshIron]

They are clearly very nice wheels, and well-documented antiques. We are in a time, and have been for a while, where nice parts are so desirable for owners or re-sellers that the price paid for the parts is often as much or more than buying a project car of the same marque. Folks who are proud of their cars, and may have quite an investment already, are more than happy to pay that extra cost for just the right touch for their cars. Unless worldwide issues really take a bad turn for the worse, these old car parts will likely continue to appreciate with rapid pace. Some of the parts, as well as well as some of the cars, are now commodities. 

[JsnPpp]

Damn! $6300!!! I thought $3k was already the peak.

 

As others have said; if it makes the car, and the car is important to you and you have the money, then why not? 

 

No matter how you cut it though, that is a lot for steel wheels for sure. 

 

But they are nice.

[Conserv]

The winning bid is more reasonable when you view it on a price-per-pound basis… ??

 

And I thought the CMR-Borrani’s, that sold for $4,200 last year, were crazy money… ?

 

No Reserve: 13x5.5" CMR Borrani Wheels for BMW 2002tii

BRINGATRAILER.COM

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Bid for the chance to own a No Reserve: 13×5.5″ CMR Borrani Wheels for BMW 2002tii at...

 

Regards,

 

Steve

 

 

[BritshIron]

It does not really matter whether the winning bidder has added value to his car by purchasing these great wheels. He's added value to his life, with that sort of enjoyment that we all recognize. And, if the car is as original and nice as is described in the after comments on BaT, then he can sit on the OEM wheels, enjoy the Alpina wheels, and "Don't worry about a thing." Happy Memorial Day Weekend everyone, and God Bless Our Troops! Much aloha, Robert

[oh2ryan]

They were my wheels and after much back and forth I decided I wasn't going to use them after all on my 04/71 Italian 2002tii. A set of Italian market wheels from 1971 fell into my lap and that felt like the way to go. There was a lot of interest in the Alpinas due to the early date stamps, means of restoring them, and the matching set. Having the right two bidders involved was nice as well. 

 

I am all for the variety of conditions we each keep our 2002s in. I have had the $1000 2002 built with junkyard bits and I have restored and modified a few. Heck, I am almost $100k into my 2002tii project now and its not yet done. When you find that perfect part for a high dollar 2002 especially, money often has to take the back seat. I have certainly paid a premium for some NLA or odd bits over the years. Just part of the chase when trying to create your perfect BMW.

[BritshIron]

@oh2ryan 100%. You did the right thing. My set of Borrani steelies, date coded 4/68, were deliberated and over-analyzed  with concern at a price point of  $800 in restored condition, two years ago. I had Valley Wire Wheel do a final confirmation on the trueness of the wheels. These old parts are skyrocketing past us in value, and that's just the way of the world, and the hobby.

 

God bless our troops on this Memorial Day. My Dad served in WWII, and my brother in Special Forces in Viet Nam, and other, unnamed conflicts. Happy Memorial Day! Aloha, Robert

[JohnS]

Just curious.  Does anyone know what the offset is on those 13x5.5 Borrani wheels?  I know the 13x6 Ronal wheels I'm currently restoring are ET 28 and seem to fit perfectly with 185/70 or 205/60 tires.  I'm just a curious bystander.  Thanks,

John

 

My Dad served in the Korean war, but never really wanted to talk about it.  He was a damn good marksman and gunsmith though. R.I.P.

 

This is what I surmise from realoem:

 

Early "tii" 5x13 alloys:  ET 26

Early 5x13 steelies:  ET ?

Late "dog dish" 5x13 alloys:  ET 28

Late 74 and up 5x13 steelies:  ET 29

Later E21 5.5x13 steelies and alloys ET 18

 

Edited June 4, 2022 by JohnS

[Conserv]

2 hours ago, JohnS said:

Just curious.  Does anyone know what the offset is on those 13x5.5 Borrani wheels?  I know the 13x6 Ronal wheels I'm currently restoring are ET 28 and seem to fit perfectly with 185/70 or 205/60 tires.  I'm just a curious bystander.  Thanks,

John

 

My Dad served in the Korean war, but never really wanted to talk about it.  He was a damn good marksman and gunsmith though. R.I.P.

 

This is what I surmise from realoem:

 

Early "tii" 5x13 alloys:  ET 26

Early 5x13 steelies:  ET ?

Late "dog dish" 5x13 alloys:  ET 28

Late 74 and up 5x13 steelies:  ET 29

Later E21 5.5x13 steelies and alloys ET 18

 

It’s all in the Wheels Database, John. Here are the CMR-Borrani’s and the CMR-Alpina’s, both in a 5.5” width, and both ET22.

 

 

 

And I believe all the other rims you’ve listed have entries in the database as well.

 

In addition, the CMR steel rims have a separate spreadsheet, attached to the original post of this thread, as well as a few other places within the thread. The attached is, I believe, the most recent version.

 

Best regards,

 

Steve

 

 

[JohnS]

Thank you Steve.  The database, go to the database.  Being a computer programmer I should know better ?

 

So it looks like all of the 5.5x13's (R1-440 & R1-485) are ET 22...  Interesting

 

Those R1-561's at 6x13 ET 30 look like the shizzle...

 

Or either of the 5x13's (R1-439 & R1-484)  at ET 27...

 

I know it's only a few millimeters, but

 

Given this I would assume that the 5x13 R1-439 Alpina model with the round holes are the holy grail?

 

They're all out of my price range so it doesn't really matter anyway.  I love all of them though.  Especially when they're painted that gray color.

 

Edited June 4, 2022 by JohnS

[JohnP_02]

35 minutes ago, JohnS said:

Those R1-561's at 6x13 ET 30 look like the shizzle...

They are ?

 

[Conserv]

2 hours ago, JohnS said:

 

… Given this I would assume that the 5x13 R1-439 Alpina model with the round holes are the holy grail?…

 

Well… yes and no, John!

 

The 5” Alpina steelies are probably the hardest to find. But the demand for 5” rims, essentially stock rims, is quite low. Most ‘02 owners today really want 6” rims — which would eliminate the Alpina steelies entirely. But a relatively smaller market audience, willing to live with a 5.5” rim, bids 5.5” Alpina rims way way up: they’re the widest Alpina steelies available!

 

Best regards,

 

Steve

 

 

[skyking96w]

On 5/4/2022 at 2:15 PM, Conserv said:

 

I don't suppose you have a stock (steel rim) '02 lug nut lying around -- say, holding the spare wheel -- that you could photograph next to the Alpina lug nut? I'm just curious to see whether the conical ends of both are nearly identical. I would expect them to be identical or nearly so. This, of course, assumes that Alpina didn't cheat by using alloy rim lug nuts on steel rims...

 

Thanks and best regards,

 

Steve

 

 

 

 

Just saw this request today, so my apologies for the late reply.  For some reason I don't get all notifications.  Anyway, yes, the conical ends are the same:

[quant]

We’ve talked about the ‘Lochscheibenrad’ before, but -

 

Does anybody know / have pictures of the KOEPCHEN-Spezial-Lochscheibenrad ?

 

See bottom right:

Edited June 17, 2022 by quant