engine and drivetrain Oil Shooting Out the Exhaust - SOLVED!!!

[02Coastie]

After firing up my newly rebuilt engine and letting it come up to temp, I all of the sudden had massive amounts of smoke pouring out of the exhaust. I shut down immediately. Upon further inspection, approximately 2 cups of oil drained out of my exhaust. After checking plugs and pulling the header, I confirmed that #3 cylinder was the culprit. At first I suspected the MLS head gasket hadn't sealed well, but after thinking that through, it seems like the only entry point from the head gasket to #3 would be the drain back holes. Given the amount of oil, I can't imagine the head gasket being the culprit. So, that brings me to the head which was professionally rebuilt by a well know M10 guru.  With that much oil pushed through the exhaust, it has to have come from a bad valve guide/seal right? Has anyone else experienced this? For the record, all other cylinders were clean and showed no signs of oil or coolant.

Edited November 12, 2016 by 02Coastie

[ray_]

Egads.

 

Sounds like a crack to me.

 

But in conkitchen style, what do I know?

 

Good luck with it.

[Tommy]

Interesting to hear what you'll find. Surely not a common problem. That's huge amount of oil going through valve guide, maybe if exhaust valve was totally missing

I think this is related to your oil pressure issue. Is it possible that head is cracked so that it would push oil with pressure into cyl #3 or exhaust port? Never heard such thing happening.

[Son of Marty]

I'm kinda with Ray, if it's not the gasket ( and I can't see the oil drain hole dumping that much oil) to loose that much oil it's got to be leaking under pressure if your valve guides or seal were leaking I think you would be smoking for sure but it would burn the oil and not let it build up 2 cups of liquid at least not for a long long time. 

Edited November 11, 2016 by Son of Marty

[avoirdupois]

.

 

 

Edited November 12, 2016 by avoirdupois

[02Coastie]

Unfortunately I think Ray may be the winner. Valve guides look stable so it has to be a crack. NR3 was welded so I'm guessing the repair didn't hold. Back to the head doctor for proper diagnosis.

[zinz]

crapola... that sux.

 

Ed

[Preyupy]

There is not direct route in the head for oil to get into the #3 combustion chamber in a quantity large enough for "2 cups of oil" to drain from your exhaust.  What intake are you running?  How do you have the crankcase breather hooked up?  Did you remember to put rings on the #3 piston?  Did you do a compression test before you took it apart? Are you sure it is oil? if the car has been sitting for a long time it might just have been condensation built up in the exhaust that finally got warm enough to come out of the pipe.    If Terry Tinney put the head together I would start looking everywhere else FIRST. 

 

Pressurized oil enters the head at the front head bolt hole on the intake side of the head.  it goes down the intake rocker shaft and feeds the rocker arms, cam bearings and the spray bar for the cam.  It crosses to the exhaust side of the head the into the rocker shaft for the exhaust rockers.  At the back of the intake rocker shaft it is open to supply oil pressure to the oil pressure light (and gauge if you are running one there)  The only oil that can come down the valve guides will be what is available being splashed around under the valve springs that gets past the valve guide seals.  A crack in the head anywhere close to the combustion chamber would be into a water galley not pressurized oil.  I suspect you have the crankcase breather hose hooked to the vacuum port on the #3 runner on the intake manifold and you are sucking oil out of the valve cover/cam area.   

[02Coastie]

1 hour ago, Preyupy said:

 What intake are you running? 

 

How do you have the crankcase breather hooked up?  Did you remember to put rings on the #3 piston?  Did you do a compression test before you took it apart? Are you sure it is oil? if the car has been sitting for a long time it might just have been condensation built up in the exhaust that finally got warm enough to come out of the pipe.    If Terry Tinney put the head together I would start looking everywhere else FIRST. 

 

Pressurized oil enters the head at the front head bolt hole on the intake side of the head.  it goes down the intake rocker shaft and feeds the rocker arms, cam bearings and the spray bar for the cam.  It crosses to the exhaust side of the head the into the rocker shaft for the exhaust rockers.  At the back of the intake rocker shaft it is open to supply oil pressure to the oil pressure light (and gauge if you are running one there)  The only oil that can come down the valve guides will be what is available being splashed around under the valve springs that gets past the valve guide seals.  A crack in the head anywhere close to the combustion chamber would be into a water galley not pressurized oil.  I suspect you have the crankcase breather hose hooked to the vacuum port on the #3 runner on the intake manifold and you are sucking oil out of the valve cover/cam area.   

 What intake are you running? - E30 318 EFI. The breather was not hooked up.

 

Did you remember to put rings on the #3 piston? - Yes :-)

 

Did you do a compression test before you took it apart? - No, I should have.

 

Are you sure it is oil? if the car has been sitting for a long time it might just have been condensation built up in the exhaust that finally got warm enough to come out of the pipe. - Definitely oil. If you look at the header pic, you can see that it's just NR3 that has oil in it. The plug had oil on it as well.

 

If Terry Tinney put the head together I would start looking everywhere else FIRST.  - I don't disagree. I spoke with him already and I'm bringing the head to him to check. Like me, he's just as dumbfounded as I am. But in the end, with that quantity of oil, it seems like it's either pressurized or somehow the oil in head valley was pulled into the cylinder ala slipping valve guide. A long shot for sure, but I don't know how else it could have come in.

 

The only other way I could see would be up from the piston, but with no visible scoring and at least the top ring intact, I don't see that quantity getting in with such immediacy. It might burn some, but dumping that much that quickly points to something else I think.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[jimk]

It had coolant in the radiator, yes?

[TobyB]

I'm with Byron- 2 cups is just not a crack, it's a hole.  And it's a hole into a pressurized oil passage...

 

t

 

[zinz]

I just noticed Toby's signature.... HAHAHAHAHAHA 

 

Ed

[JohnH]

Didn't I read somewhere that the exhaust studs could allow oil to flow past them if they weren't fitted properly? There does seem to be a lot of oil on the exhaust flange, so were the exhaust gaskets fitted properly? Does the tubular exhaust flange fit flush?   

[TobyB]

Only if you left one OUT.  And then it'd end up on the floor.

 

The amount of oil he's talking about could only come from a pressurized source, or the crankcase, via the

ventilation or the rings.  And you'd have to leave the rings out to get THAT much up that fast.

 

There's a big hole somewhere not-good...

 

t

 

[Son of Marty]

I'm just spitballin here but the m-10 oil system is not real complex but maybe at sometime (and I'm not pointing fingers at 02coastie) but someone torqued one of the head bolts on the drivers side into a hole that still had liquid in it and it cracked into the main oil gallery below allowing oil to be pushed up to the head gasket other than something like that it's hard to see where pressurized oil has access to #3 cylinder.