Did BMW 1600 come with flag or trap mirror?

[Freude am Fahren]

So to summarize, my April 1970 produced car should have a swan neck! Now i have never seen these come up for sale! Where do i find a swan neck mirror? Any tips?

[NickVyse]

German eBay usually has one for about 100 bucks

[HBChris]

Most of the eBay mirrors I’ve seen have been fair to poor condition and with the stud in front meaning it can only be mounted at the leading edge of the door in euro fashion.  And they rarely have the rubber gasket.  There is a well known German eBay seller who has new reproductions but at $1000 for the pair. 

[Conserv]

2 hours ago, HBChris said:

....There is a well known German eBay seller who has new reproductions but at $1000 for the pair. 

 

No wonder he's well known! 

 

Oh, wait, that's for a pair, so only $500 each...

 

Best,

 

Steve

 

Edited January 31, 2018 by Conserv

[kiva667]

I lucked out a while back and got an NOS swan neck with gasket for $100 but I forget which web site I found it on tho I do remember it came from France!

 

But I was persistent and scoured the internet for a few years to find it.

[Conserv]

6 hours ago, Freude am Fahren said:

 

The word “Spiegel” means mirror in German. In this case most likely refers that the document is a copy but thought it serendipitous given the topic at hand

 

Hmm....

 

Thanks, Eamon.  And John_in_VA sent me a PM translating Spiegel into “mirror,” noting, alternatively, it might be the inspector’s name and stamp.

 

But, I visited my....Archivio, and found a packing list from a 1973 2002 (VIN 2587836).  It’s more detailed than the 1976 version, and someone has even checked off the items that were present at inspection!  And...lo and behold...the 1973 version lists a mirror (Spiegel) as a separate line item, suggesting to me that the Spiegel stamped onto the 1976 packing list refers to a mirror.

 

If true, this just confirms that the outside mirror was not attached when the car left the factory.  It doesn’t resolve differences of opinion on where the mirrors were installed: at (a.) the Port of Entry? or (b.) the dealer?  And maybe the practice changed over time, shifting from the Port of Entry to the dealer...

 

Regards,

 

Steve

 

 

 

Edited February 1, 2018 by Conserv

[jgerock]

What's the wedge?

[Conserv]

9 minutes ago, jgerock said:

What's the wedge?

 

Wheel chock!

 

[jgerock]

3 minutes ago, Conserv said:

 

Wheel chock!

 

Never seen one that came with our cars. Maybe left on the trailer??

[Conserv]

2 hours ago, jgerock said:

Never seen one that came with our cars. Maybe left on the trailer??

 

It was an e9 item: see Chris’s post from yesterday.  This form was used for multiple models.  Notice that this particular form, for a 2002, does not have a red “checkmark” next to the wheel chock.

 

Best regards,

 

Steve

 

Edited February 1, 2018 by Conserv

[2Red69s]

Hi All,

I worked at a BMW dealer in 1974-76. As I recall, mirrors were installed at the port because they had to drive the cars around a bit and load them on the truck for delivery. (BTW--2 mirrors = one inside the car, 1 drivers side outside.) Passenger side mirrors were an upsell accessory, dealer installed. Trapezoid (through 75) and flag mirrors (75 -76) were definitely lefts & rights, with different part #'s.

 

From what I remember before working at the dealer, having owned 67, 68 and 69 and 72 02's,  swan neck mirrors came on 67 and early 68's mounted all the way at the leading edge of the doors (having said that, I have also seen later 68's and early 69 Euro models where they are aft of the wing window.) I think it is related to the stamping of the door sheetmetal and when they went to the keyhole style cage nut mounting is when they switched to trapezoids. Most of the swan neck mirrors I have seen have a bolt/stud at the front edge which mounted through the very front of the door with an angled spacer (like on the trailing edge of the door handles) and nut, accessed in the hinging area without removing the door panel.

 

My 02¢ worth

-David

[HBChris]

Dave, thanks for clearing that up!

 

Chris

[2Red69s]

Chris- I'm not sure I did clear that up, and/or if you are being sarcastic 

 

[jgerock]

Here is the packing list from my May 30, 1969 2002

[Mike Self]

On 1/31/2018 at 9:15 PM, 2Red69s said:

swan neck mirrors came on 67 and early 68's mounted all the way at the leading edge of the doors (having said that, I have also seen later 68's and early 69 Euro models where they are aft of the wing window.) I think it is related to the stamping of the door sheetmetal and when they went to the keyhole style cage nut mounting is when they switched to trapezoids. Most of the swan neck mirrors I have seen have a bolt/stud at the front edge which mounted through the very front of the door with an angled spacer (like on the trailing edge of the door handles) and nut, accessed in the hinging area without removing the door panel.

The swan neck mirrors that were mounted on the very leading edge of the front door, using a stud forward and a machine screw/captive nut aft were actually "left over" from NK sedan production.  They were carried over to 1600-2 and (possibly) early 2002 production until someone realized that positioned thusly they interfered with fully opening the vent window.  So sometime in 1968 they switched to the swan neck mirror with two machine screw/captive nut mounts, allowing the mirror to be mounted further aft on the door so it would clear the vent window when opened.  

 

An easy way to tell if those stud-mount mirrors were used on 2002s is to look at one of the 1968 2002 road tests in Road & Track, Car & Driver, etc.  They all used two  very early US 2002s with NJ or CA mfg plates--they had two piece wheel covers, an embossed hood trim piece and other distinctive parts that were unique to the very first US spec 02s.  

 

My Feb '69 production 2002 has the "two machine screw/captive nuts" mount.  

 

mike

 

PS--even though I bought my '02 new (Bavarian Motors, Queens NY) I didn't get the packing slip with the rest of the paperwork...Jim I'd love it if you could scan your copy and send it to me as it would be the same as what would have come with my '69.