72 Tii on BaT

[Conserv]

3 hours ago, COOP said:

 

Hi Steve,

 

To me this car actually has very little in common with the car that BMW built from scratch (other than the fact that they’re both stupid-nice 2002s) given that the Mobile Tradition car was 100% bone stock using all new parts and this car is a totally non-stock spec restomod, resurrected from a rust bucket (true, also using mostly new parts).

 

i disagree on your point about the wheels, given that this (again) is a restomod with many performances enhancements, including big brakes that wouldn’t come close to fitting under factory steel wheels. I think the H&B units are perfect for this build: Period correct, rare-ish and stunning.

 

i agree with $80-100K. Then we’ll all have the distinct pleasure of being treated to yet another wave of whinging, soulful lamentations from the “real enthusiasts” relating to how “ridiculous” the prices of 2002s have become.

 

Oops!

 

I didn’t read enough, COOP, to realize it won’t fit 13” rims! Bad boy!

 

To me, sport suspensions are easily reversible. If a car has stock subframes, or even stock subframe mounts, a “restomod” suspension is simply a bolt-on item, easily “fixed” by the next owner...  ?

 

Best regards,

 

Steve

 

Edited October 16, 2018 by Conserv

[adawil2002]

Have seen this Tii, numerous at Brisbane and Novato Cars & Coffee. It is a really nice example of what can be done given the resources available. In my opinion, this should rival Mike Pelly's $93.5K auction in August 2017.

[AustrianVespaGuy]

1 hour ago, COOP said:

i agree with $80-100K. Then we’ll all have the distinct pleasure of being treated to yet another wave of whinging, soulful lamentations from the “real enthusiasts” relating to how “ridiculous” the prices of 2002s have become.

While I think @COOP and I have differing viewpoints on 2002 valuation, no, there will not be any 'whining' or accusations of 'ridiculousness,' just a bit of surprise, and also delight that the owner will be able to recoup on his very impressive effort/investment with this car and joy that good 2002s are clearly this well-revered.  Such cars are worth no more or less what the market will pay for them, and this example clearly will set an important benchmark!

[g_force]

12 hours ago, COOP said:

One of the BaT commenters (@Shnizoz) expressed some interesting concerns about the fact that no jigs or fixtures were used to maintain the structural integrity of the upper body when the entire floor structure was swapped out. I wonder what some of your opinions are about this. 

 

This is totally an educated guess, but looking at the picture showing how much of the floor structure was grafted in, I'm not sure jigs/fixtures were needed.  It looks like all of the frame rails, rear subframe mounting points and the like were intact on the donor floor.  If you set the upper body down to line up to their corresponding parts of the floor structure, and made a few measurements to ensure the door holes were square and the shock mounts were in the right spot, I'd guess (again, just a guess) the car would be reasonably straight.  Plus, think of how flexible the '02 shell is - lots of movement in locations of things as its driven.  

[COOP]

nt

Edited October 16, 2018 by COOP

[COOP]

10 minutes ago, COOP said:

 

I said “whinging,” not “whining.”

 

 I actually don’t have a viewpoint on 2002 valuations, AT ALL. I only have an educated observation about free market economics, namely that at any given moment in time, something is worth exactly what someone will pay for it (which you astutely echoed above). 

 

I just get really, really exhausted hearing people (inevitably non-buyers) contemptuously pop off that something was not worth what it sold for. That just sounds moronic to me. Sorry.

 

I can promise that the owner will not be coming close to “recouping” on his “investment,” even if it hits 6 figures. Back to basic economics, we may have “differing viewpoints” as to what the definition of the word “investment” means. By my understanding, it entails making money, not losing it.

 

[wkohler]

There was confirmation from the shop that what was shown was just a test-fit and once that was completed, it was moved onto a frame rack and the transplant was completed. I actually think this piece of information was vital and will go a long way to making bidders feel more confident.  Can be the trouble with showing limited in-process photos without explanation.  

 

Also, since it came up, the floor came from a wrecked car, but it obviously wasn’t wrecked enough so maybe a beam or tree fell on it.  Photos show new front frame rails as well.  There could easily be $60k or more just in the body.  

[otisdog]

When did 'whinging' replace 'whining' and why did it?

[John_in_VA]

9 minutes ago, otisdog said:

When did 'whinging' replace 'whining' and why did it?

 

It didn't - two different words.  It's more of a British thing - consider your horizons broadened!

[COOP]

https://www.grammarphobia.com/blog/2007/03/on-whinge-and-whine.html

[SydneyTii]

Whinging is what the Aussies say the POMs do?

[02Les]

8 hours ago, SydneyTii said:

Whinging is what the Aussies say the POMs do?

Only about the Ashes & the bloody flies over there...?

[NYNick]

No sale at $75K. What does that tell us?

 

I for one thought the car was drop dead stunning. Looked to me to be an updated 02 with all the fixin's and none of the modern day nannies. And the body work was just spectacular.

 

All that aside and along with the Delia 'provenance', there's a lot of competition in the $100k neighborhood, classic or not. I'm not sure I would shell out 6 figures for any Tii, but I'd consider doing so for a 930. Chalk and cheese I know, but a lot more car for the money IMO. Then there's long hoods....

 

Not to mention all the modern BMW's M's you could buy for that money, or the fact that the classic car market has slowed as of late. There are modern super cars out there for $75K...just shop Porsche 997 Turbos.

 

Gorgeous car. I'm betting there's a deal in the making offline.

[seattle2002tii]

While well done, this Tii is neither original or highly modified.  Highest dollar is paid for an original Tii with clean owner history, low miles and original paint.  The Tii offered on BAT had a stock engine and mostly stock interior.  I feel if you want top dollar for a modified car, it needs to be special or unique.

[COOP]

Gentlemen! Stop employing sound logic to try to figure out “what happened” or “what this tells us.” In my opinion, the conclusion of this listing tells us absolutely NOTHING, other than the fact that on a given day, in a given selling environment, two or more buyers were simply not present who wanted this car enough to pay more than $75,500 for it. End of story. I really don’t believe that this outcome tells us anything meaningful about the greater “market conditions.” Just my personal view.

 

Where I was wrong is that I guessed the reserve to be around $75K.

 

Trust me, I too spend plenty of time thinking about what else a buyer could have for a given amount of dough. Hell, a flawless, freshly serviced F355 6-Speed with 15K miles sold 2 weeks ago on BaT for just over $70K.

 

I think one aspect that gets overlooked in the whole “this is ridiculous” analysis is that people aren’t just buying a car. They’re buying priceless access back to idealized and romanticized days gone by. 

Edited October 17, 2018 by COOP