2020..... a good year?

[joysterm]

Happy New Year to all, and for those who may not be FB users I pass along a post from this morning that maybe of interest or worthy of discussion depending where you are in life. For me I have been on the back side of mine for a while now,  approaching the 18th so this news is,  I guess,  is good news although I do have my reservations.   In  any case here is an excerpt from that post. 

 

"2020 has been a good year to be long 2002s!

Based on bringatrailer.com sales, the average price of sedans rose to $22,628, up 43% over 2019. And the average price for a tii rose to $36,835 are up 35%. Maybe not as good as the stock market, but a hell of a lot more fun than a brokerage statement.

The highest priced sedan brought $47,000.

The highest price Tii traded hands for $102,200! And at least six of them brought over $50k!

Unit counts for 2020 were similarly up with 65 sedans and 31 Tiis trading hands. This compares to 39 sedans and about the same number of Tiis sold on BAT in 2019.

Since I started tracking prices in 2016, prices overall for sedans are up 57% and 80% for Tiis.

Speaking from experience, it is still cheaper buying a completed car vs redoing it yourself. But what fun is that?".........Peter Beren

 

Here is the spreadsheet that accompanied the post for those who maybe interested.

 

sold 2002s-3.xlsx

Edited January 9, 2021 by joysterm

[Conserv]

This is so great, Mike!

 

Thanks and best regards,

 

Steve

 

[joysterm]

Thanks Steve, I guess a few guys will be phoning their insurance agents now...hahah

[Rodolfo Lasparri]

Thanks Mike, great stuff indeed!

 

Bret

[Steve Tochi]

Thank you, lot of excellent painstaking work.  I'm going to show it to my wife first, then insurance agent.  I know of several Tii's trading ~6 figures in off market deals restored by a reputable guy here in SoCal.   

Technically, I believe any profit from the sale of a car is subject to capital gains, I don't know who would self report, or how this is enforced by the IRS.  Seems conversely you could therefore write off a loss on the sale of a car.  Any CPA's out there want to chime in?

 

[2002#3]

You did a superb job assembling valuable information for us.  Thank you.

Larry

[Conserv]

8 hours ago, Steve Tochi said:

Thank you, lot of excellent painstaking work.  I'm going to show it to my wife first, then insurance agent.  I know of several Tii's trading ~6 figures in off market deals restored by a reputable guy here in SoCal.   

Technically, I believe any profit from the sale of a car is subject to capital gains, I don't know who would self report, or how this is enforced by the IRS.  Seems conversely you could therefore write off a loss on the sale of a car.  Any CPA's out there want to chime in?

 

Hey, Steve,

 

My CPA licenses lapsed nearly 20 years ago and taxes for individuals were never my “specialty”. But I don’t believe there is symmetry between recognizing gains and losses for most car owners. There might be a position that a true car “investor” (doesn’t buy a car to drive) could take a capital loss on a car, but I’d check with my tax advisor before you do this. 99.9%+ of car owners would not qualify as “investors” and most of us would be characterized as “collectors” or “plain ol’ car lovers”....

 

Best regards,

 

Steve C.

 

 

[joysterm]

Guys, My apologies as  it appears that some are under the impression  I produced the accompaning spread sheet,   but the credit actually belongs to the author of the FB post, Mr. Peter Beren.  I must humbly confess  my spread sheet skills are limited to not much more than the cut and paste function.

Edited January 9, 2021 by joysterm

[Steve Tochi]

1 hour ago, Conserv said:

Hey, Steve,

 

My CPA licenses lapsed nearly 20 years and taxes for individuals were never my “specialty”. But I don’t believe there is symmetry between recognizing gains and losses for most car owners. There might be a position that a true car “investor” (doesn’t buy a car to drive) could take a capital loss on a car, but I’d check with my tax advisor before you do this. 99.9%+ of car owners would not qualify as “investors” and most of us would be characterized as “collectors” or “plain ol’ car lovers”....

 

Best regards,

 

Steve C.

 

 

Thanks for the clarification, we are all enthusiasts and none of do this as an investment, right?  But in any event, lets keep this between us FAQ members, and not give our legislators any ideas.  This is what I found on the internet which must mean its 100% true.

What to know about taxes when you sell a vehicle - Carvana Blog

 

[kiva667]

Leaving aside the 02s for a moment, let’s consider 2020 and the NKs.

 

My own NK 2000 was bid up to $11025 in August on BaT, which wouldn’t even cover the price of the parts I’ve bought over the years.

 

But yes, it was a good year because I decided to keep my car for another 10 years!  In 2030 we will see what price an NK daily driver will fetch.

[MikeD]

Mike, Thanks for the info especially the spread sheet.  This will definitely come in handy for insurance purposes.  Lets hope E30 prices starts to climb as well.

Hope you are doing well,

Mike D

[Jetdrive9]

Stayed in the garage a lot. So I was happy.

[TobyB]

Not so good for me, really.  I was in the 'poor get poorer' category...

 

t

not a fan of overmonetized 'classics'...

[Mike Self]

My '73 clocked fewer than 300 miles this year (vs 4-6k normally) due to a lack of events to attend and just general daily summer transport.  So it was appreciating whilst sitting in my garage!

 

Two drawbacks with our cars becoming increasingly valuable:  we'll start getting worried about driving 'em regularly for fear of damage or theft.  The same thing happened to Porsches:  first 356s and now 911s--heck even 912s and 914-6s.  Our cars are meant to be driven, not become garage queens...Second drawback:  people--particularly young, impecunious folks will be priced out of the market, even for raggedy project cars--ones that we would have parted out even 5 years ago  

 

So, folks, keep driving 'em with your normal amount of care and enjoy 'em.  

 

My 2021 rant.

 

mike

[gary32]

Thanks for the info.

Some things in life just make no logical sense.

Seems like those things always bring you the greatest joy.