Pictures from the Bay Area 02 Swap & Show 22

[yeewiz]

 

Here's some pictures from Saturday's Swap & Show 22 ...  

 

[layers]

Bob-- Thanks again for your help yesterday at S&S-22, including your excellent photos!  Besides photos, your help transporting things, manning the raffle ticket sales table and both you and your wife helping keep the canopies on the ground during the 25-MPH afternoon "breeze" show how this event is successful primarily due to the volunteers who pitch in to make it happen.

 

Your photos help capture both the ambiance of the event and also some of the delightful smaller features that make all of us keep enthused to do it again!  Maybe some of your photos belong in the FAQ wheel gallery.

 

Also, I created an image album where you and others can post more photos from S&S-22: [BayArea 02 galleries].  Use the BayArea 02 Swap & Show-2022 gallery.  Using an album like this helps keep photos in an easy-to-find location without searching for different posts in various places.

 

Larry

[Milo]

Having been around the 02 scene for 40+ years, the cars are beginning to resemble the end products of "Monster Garage" or some street mod TV show like "West Coast Choppers" or something to that extent. The 02's small chassis slammed down over oversized 15" wheels, louvered hoods, the various body kits etc. I'm glad I didn't drive the 400 miles. I have a hard time convincing myself to drive the 5 miles or so to the annual event in LA. As far as I'm concerned most of the 02 owners now are newcomers who overpay for these cars. And, I just don't relate to most of them. The 1800Ti, which may be a TISA, looks like a gem, though. I miss those cars and the days when you can pick them up in good shape for $1,000. It's all become ridiculously expensive and increasingly accessible only to a higher socio-economic class. 

 

Last year I drove out into the farm fields of Ventura County to pick up a rebuilt 1965 1800ti motor (turned out to have standard compression NOS 1800 pistons) for $400, pressure plate, machined flywheel and new clutch disk included. The motor has been sitting since it was rebuilt in 95. That was fun because it felt like the old days when you can find great deals and plenty of these cars before they got crushed. For the most part, it's no longer the same. What can I say ?

Edited May 9, 2022 by Milo

[adawil2002]

VIN will tell you if your 1800Ti is a TISA & probably isn't. The last one I remember sold for $60K 5-6 years ago out of the Roundel. 

I've been in the '02 scene for 35 years. Brisbane is a good show with some enthusiastic people great friends. If you are leery or bored with the CA scene.  

 

You should attend the Mid-America '02 Fest in Eureka Springs Arkansas held the last weekend in April This year there were 76 '02s from 1966-1976 with few modifications.

 

The Vintage in Asheville/Hot Springs NC May 19-21 2022. Is the largest BMW only event in the US registration is capped at 650 & is currently at 400. 
 

 

 

[Mike Self]

+ 1 on Andrew's comments.  Radical modifications to 2002s seem to be more prevalent on the West Coast than the East and Midwest--at least those that are driven to events.  Take a look at the Mid America web site and you'll see that most of the cars are pretty stock except for such things as wheels, smallish flares and here and there spoilers.  Same with Vintage...

 

And often the wheel sizes are a reflection of the increasing difficulty of finding 13 inch tires that don't negatively affect the car's handling.  

 

But...as is often pointed out on the FAQ and other '02 hangouts, to each his/her own...it's your car, so do with it what you like (unless of course it's a rare model or extremely low mileage--then you really should preserve it)

 

mike

[CoastalCrush]

8 hours ago, Milo said:

Having been around the 02 scene for 40+ years, the cars are beginning to resemble the end products of "Monster Garage" or some street mod TV show like "West Coast Choppers" or something to that extent. The 02's small chassis slammed down over oversized 15" wheels, louvered hoods, the various body kits etc. I'm glad I didn't drive the 400 miles. I have a hard time convincing myself to drive the 5 miles or so to the annual event in LA. As far as I'm concerned most of the 02 owners now are newcomers who overpay for these cars. And, I just don't relate to most of them. The 1800Ti, which may be a TISA, looks like a gem, though. I miss those cars and the days when you can pick them up in good shape for $1,000. It's all become ridiculously expensive and increasingly accessible only to a higher socio-economic class. 

 

Last year I drove out into the farm fields of Ventura County to pick up a rebuilt 1965 1800ti motor (turned out to have standard compression NOS 1800 pistons) for $400, pressure plate, machined flywheel and new clutch disk included. The motor has been sitting since it was rebuilt in 95. That was fun because it felt like the old days when you can find great deals and plenty of these cars before they got crushed. For the most part, it's no longer the same. What can I say ?

Glad you didn’t show up. Keep your grumpy old man vibes at home ??

[AceAndrew]

Have you seen 2002 car show pictures from the eighties in Germany?!  THOSE were some fantastic fiberglass creations, makes these new ones seem tame by comparison.  Your "good old days" of cheaper pricing also ironically meant that people were less concerned in keeping them stock.  The "new" owners seem to be scared to do anything to devalue their investment.  

 

Can't wait to make the trip up at some point.

 

[Milo]

2 hours ago, CoastalCrush said:

Glad you didn’t show up. Keep your grumpy old man vibes at home ??

Old ? Does 57 constitute "Old" these days ?

I knew I was getting "Old" when I noticed I a couple of years ago that I qualify for the "Senior" discount menu at Denny's.

My 02s make me feel younger, though, as I've been driving them since I got my license in 82.

[Milo]

2 hours ago, AceAndrew said:

Have you seen 2002 car show pictures from the eighties in Germany?!  THOSE were some fantastic fiberglass creations, makes these new ones seem tame by comparison.  Your "good old days" of cheaper pricing also ironically meant that people were less concerned in keeping them stock.  The "new" owners seem to be scared to do anything to devalue their investment.  

 

Can't wait to make the trip up at some point.

Andrew,

For the most part, the modifications back then were from the period. But, now its mixing and parts from 70s, 80s, 90s, 2000s etc. And, that results in all types of Frankenstein creations. I remember when the 15" wheels came out with the corresponding low profile 50 or 55 series tires. The combination of a heavy 15" wheel with such a low profile tire results in heavy steering and a rough ride, unlike a horse drawn carriage with solid steel or wood wheels and no rubber. I can't imagine riding on something like that on the cracked and rough roads of Los Angeles.

 

At least the Bay Area show is actually a "Classic" BMW show, unlike the meet down here which includes all the disposable trash which  BMW has been producing since the late 70s. The local more modern BMW "Tuner"miscreants have been terrorizing the residential streets in my neighborhood, driving 60mph + in 25mph zones and crashing into parked cars, pets and people. Glendale CA is among the most likely places in the United States for a pedestrian to be run over by one of these wanna-be racer jockeys. They've crashed into our 74 square light car while nearly missing my 69 roundie, both parked on the street. I've been parking my cars in the garage ever since.

 

And, despite all my criticism, I got to admit that the classic BMW owners from the Bay Area and the Northern part of the state seem to have better taste than most in LA. Hardly anybody showed any interest  in NK cars down here until recently. But, they seem to have been appreciated by folks up there for quite some time. When I think of all the solid and complete NKs I've seen at the local self service salvage yards during the 90s, it make me cringe. BMW Yahoos were throwing away these well engineered and quality built classics because they had their mind set on a newer e21 or e30 ?  Hundreds, if not more, NKs met their demise in this matter down here in So Cal. Nobody even removed parts from them as they sat there at Pick A Part. They went to the crusher, complete. I witnessed this first hand.

 

You could have picked-up a clean 1968 short wheel base 911 with the 2.0L motor for $10K back then. Now, the same car will set you back $200K +. My neighbor was offering me a 68 911 with a seized motor for just a fraction of that price. The average "Joe" working to make ends meet can no longer afford these cars, even if he knows how to "Wrench" on them.  I've seen it all change over the years, and that includes the people.

 

Edited May 9, 2022 by Milo

[steve k.]

I absolutely love the Bay Area 02 Swap & Show. There is something for everyone and one at the show judges people for they bring. Because of that you get a great variety. There are some incredible examples of original owner cars, both modified and stock. You find great restorations and restomods. And you will always find a rust bucket that is somehow being held together by gum and duct tape that the owner put great effort to keeping it on the road.  This is what makes this show great and at no point it is it's downfall. All cars represent the owners personalities. I go to look at cars, but mostly talk to people. 

 

Fun fact, in 1964 price fro the Shelby Cobra 289 was $5595, BMW 1800 was at $3298.   I think we might need to be upset that our cars did not appreciate in value as much as some others. 

 

steve k.

[John76]

27 minutes ago, steve k. said:

1964 price fro the Shelby Cobra 289 was $5595

In 1967 my math teacher drove one of two cars to the high school every day.

A Cobra 289 or a Sunbeam Tiger. They were always parked alongside the ratty cars that students drove to school.

Talk about trust... or disgust!

[tjones02]

On 5/8/2022 at 10:56 PM, Milo said:

Having been around the 02 scene for 40+ years, the cars are beginning to resemble the end products of "Monster Garage" or some street mod TV show like "West Coast Choppers" or something to that extent. The 02's small chassis slammed down over oversized 15" wheels, louvered hoods, the various body kits etc. I'm glad I didn't drive the 400 miles. I have a hard time convincing myself to drive the 5 miles or so to the annual event in LA. As far as I'm concerned most of the 02 owners now are newcomers who overpay for these cars. And, I just don't relate to most of them. The 1800Ti, which may be a TISA, looks like a gem, though. I miss those cars and the days when you can pick them up in good shape for $1,000. It's all become ridiculously expensive and increasingly accessible only to a higher socio-economic class.

 1. I am one of the organizers of the BayArea02 Swap&Show and have been around these cars literally my entire life having been brought home in the Tii my parents bought new fifty years ago last February, and drove to the show together. Our show and other gatherings welcome ALL enthusiasts of ‘02s whether they are original owners, or bought it that day at the show, whether they spent multiples of six figures on a restoration, or zip tied it together to push onto the lawn. We don’t judge the socioeconomic position or taste of anyone who’s a fan of these cars we all love. I’m sorry that you feel a need to.

 

1.5. With over 80 ‘02s in the lawn, many more in the swap area and more yet in the lot who only came to spectate, there was enough variety for everyone to enjoy. I suspect you would’ve liked it too. We usually pack 100 plus on the lawn. Sorry you weren’t there to add to those numbers.

 

2. Yes, we have seen a change of how some choose to build their ‘02s, some with mods that I wouldn’t choose to do on my own car. Yes. But, does that keep me from appreciating their enthusiasm, or respect them for showing their skills? No it does not. I respect that they would join me in messaging our legislators in support of allowing us all to keep driving our cars on public roads for the foreseeable future. Same as I respect the builders of cars I saw at the Sacramento Autorama the weekend before.

 

3. While I know whether that was an 1800TI or a TI/SA, I won’t tell you which. You’ll just have to wish you were there to see it in person. ?

[AceAndrew]

6 minutes ago, tjones02 said:

I respect that they would join me in messaging our legislators in support of allowing us all to keep driving our cars on public roads for the foreseeable future.

 

Tom, I cannot agree more with this statement!  We cannot believe that they will magically carve out a niche in legislation without us lobbying them on a semi-independent basis.  

[1936spyder]

I definitely notice a difference as well with how people choose to build or modify their 02’s on the West Coast (particularly in Nor/SoCal) compared to some other parts of the country.

 

I think that actually a lot of that can be attributed to the history of car culture on the West Coast and how culturally/ethnically diverse it is as well relatively speaking; there’s a lot of cross-pollination between the different scenes.

 

California is still the last frontier in the US in many ways. It’s just in the water, whether people are aware of it or not…

[Milo]

On 5/11/2022 at 11:06 AM, tjones02 said:

1. I am one of the organizers of the BayArea02 Swap&Show and have been around these cars literally my entire life having been brought home in the Tii my parents bought new fifty years ago last February, and drove to the show together. Our show and other gatherings welcome ALL enthusiasts of ‘02s whether they are original owners, or bought it that day at the show, whether they spent multiples of six figures on a restoration, or zip tied it together to push onto the lawn. We don’t judge the socioeconomic position or taste of anyone who’s a fan of these cars we all love. I’m sorry that you feel a need to.

 

1.5. With over 80 ‘02s in the lawn, many more in the swap area and more yet in the lot who only came to spectate, there was enough variety for everyone to enjoy. I suspect you would’ve liked it too. We usually pack 100 plus on the lawn. Sorry you weren’t there to add to those numbers.

 

2. Yes, we have seen a change of how some choose to build their ‘02s, some with mods that I wouldn’t choose to do on my own car. Yes. But, does that keep me from appreciating their enthusiasm, or respect them for showing their skills? No it does not. I respect that they would join me in messaging our legislators in support of allowing us all to keep driving our cars on public roads for the foreseeable future. Same as I respect the builders of cars I saw at the Sacramento Autorama the weekend before.

 

3. While I know whether that was an 1800TI or a TI/SA, I won’t tell you which. You’ll just have to wish you were there to see it in person. ?

Thanks for your input, Tom.

 

We've known each other for 20 years ever since I met you at the San Louis Obispo show in 2002 where you took some pics of my then freshly painted Granada 1600. Given that clue, you know who I am. I'm sure you worked hard organizing the Bay Area event in that very scenic setting by the bay. But, I just no longer have the nerves to put up with some of these people. It's not the cars, but rather the people.

 

As far as that 1800ti with the two tone Red / Black interior, it brings back memories. At some point during 1983 when I was a mere 17-18 years of age I answered an ad in the Recycler in Hollywood, CA, where I purchased a set of Solex PHH sidedraft carbs, manifolds, air canister and linkage from a guy who had several 1800tis and 1800s sitting in the driveway next to his bungalow. The driveway was so packed with cars that you needed to step on the hood of the 1800ti to enter the dwelling through the side door. He sold me the package for  $100 and threw in a complete 1800ti, minus the head for FREE. The car was solid with no visible rust.  I didn't have the will power nor the resources to get it towed to my home in the San Fernando Valley, and simply left it on the street after removing the identical seats in Red / Black. They were in excellent shape. When I got home I realized the NK seats were too wide for my 1600-2. And I gave them away to a friend who owned a Red Olds Cutlass from the late  60s or early 70s era. He actually installed those seats into the Cutlass and eventually destroyed them.

 

During the early 90s I drove my Granada Red 1600-2 from LA to the Bay Area on many occasions. I purchased the car for a mere $900 in driving condition. After going through it and fixing the brakes and adding new springs, Bilsteins and sway bars I used it as my transportation across the state for 10 years before finally refreshing the motor and repainting it shortly before you saw it in 2002. It always had a stock running gear.

 

On one of those trips I got disoriented and tired along Interstate 5 somewhere near Harris Ranch, or whatever it is called, in the middle of nowhere. The nearest town is 50 miles away. I had the window partially open and the wind noise muffled out the engine noise. My tach wasn't working. I didn't notice I was driving the car in 3rd gear at 75 mph with the 4.11 diff. since my last rest stop 45 minutes prior. That must have translated to 6.000rpms. And, I was completely deaf and unaware. My oil pump light went on and I immediately shut the motor down and coasted to the side of the road. The Highway Patrol gave me a ride to Gustine, 50 miles up the road, where I stayed with friends. The next day I borrowed a car and drove across the Pacheco Pass to Gilroy to a family friend and classic BMW mechanic. He gave me a used oil pump. I drove back to Gustine, where I spent the Christmas Eve in 27 degree weather replacing the oil pump with just my little basic tool kit I carry in my trunk. I finished the install at 2:00AM, and the car was ready and good as ever. That's how we rolled back then. I was only 25-26 years of age at the time and fresh out of college.

 

Now, the community has been hijacked by a bunch of self-entitled  and conceited wannabees with deep pockets. They were always there, but now there are too many of them. And, they are accustomed to having Circus Monkeys or "Production Assistants" tend to their every need. And, I refuse to associate with these usurpers. A couple of them from the Silicon Valley have badgered me, making light of my junk yard foraging etc.  But, I'd like to see these clowns, who grew up with a key board and cellphones, get their fingers nails greasy, bust their knuckles and change out an oil pump with just basic tools and a flashlight in the field at night and in freezing conditions. These shows have become synonymous with this new generation of tech Yuppies and stuffy old Cold Warriors who seem to think that everybody less fortunate is out there to rob them of their money. 

 

I'm no longer going to attend the show here in LA. I've had enough of the BS. I may pop up at the Bay Area meet in one of my 1600-2s one day or somewhere else, but more as a result of a road trip to the area vs. deliberate purpose trip to the show. 

 

A couple of weeks ago I pulled out my cars. My Granada needed a jump from by Bristol as it's been sitting too long. The motor is worn out with major blow-by. I've built two very solid 1600-2 bottom ends with oversize NOS Mahle pistons, just need to put a couple of heads together. I've also acquired a 65 1800 motor, rebuilt and never run. And, I was debating throwing it in. It's a close cousin of the 1600-2 with the same head, block bore, pressure plate, flywheel and clutch disk. 

Edited May 13, 2022 by Milo