Spark Plug Question

[its55]

Got around to pulling a spark plug for the first time today and discovered that my plug size appears to be a Bosch W225T2 which, from what I can tell via searching, is a plug for an Alfa Romeo?

 

Ebay salesman call this part no. a "vintage plug".

 

What do you all make of this discovery?

 

From what I can find my plugs should be Bosch W8DC.

 

 

 

 

Edited June 22, 2022 by its55
typo

[JohnS]

Yup.  Those W8DC plugs from Bosch haven't been available for a while.  You can still fine them on ebay from time to time.  Lots of folks, including me, swear by the NGK plugs.  The W8DC equivalent plug from NGK is the BP5ES.  Some folks also go for the NGK BP6ES.  There's also Champion plugs that are readily available, but I don't know the number because I've never used them.  Hope that helps,

John

 

PS, I've heard that you need to be careful when ordering the NGK plugs to make sure that they have the removable (screw on) end cap or not.  If you have the older style plug wires that require the end cap on the plug to be unscrewed, this is important.  I don't know the part number difference between the fixed end cap kind and the unscrewable kind.  They used to always be the old style unscrewable ones.

Edited June 22, 2022 by JohnS

['76mintgrün'02]

1 hour ago, JohnS said:

Yup.  Those W8DC plugs from Bosch haven't been available for a while.  You can still fine them on ebay from time to time.  Lots of folks, including me, swear by the NGK plugs.  The W8DC equivalent plug from NGK is the BP5ES.  Some folks also go for the NGK BP6ES.

 

 

The NGK BP_ES plugs are NLA too.  Now NGK only offers Resistor plugs, which have 5K ohms resistors built into them.  The stock 2002 rotors also have 5K ohm resistors, so, in theory, you can substitute a 1K ohm rotor and run the NGK BPR_ES plugs.  (That's what I'm doing, as of a week ago).

 

It looks like the non resistor plugs are still available online, but I have read where people said they were sent the R plugs instead.  When I called the local NAPA to ask if they had them, they used the word "superseded" and offered the resistor plugs.

 

The BP6ES with removable tips are (were) part #7333.

 

Tom

[TobyB]

Alfas use the same plugs that BMWs do.

 

And the Alfisti are grumbling like we are.

 

t

 

[cda951]

4 hours ago, JohnS said:

 

PS, I've heard that you need to be careful when ordering the NGK plugs to make sure that they have the removable (screw on) end cap or not.  If you have the older style plug wires that require the end cap on the plug to be unscrewed, this is important.  I don't know the part number difference between the fixed end cap kind and the unscrewable kind.  They used to always be the old style unscrewable ones.

 

Are there NGK plugs where the end caps are not removable at all? All the recent ones I have used have screw on end caps, but they are then crimped on at the factory (this is what everyone here with aftermarket wires which require end caps  should be doing with these caps before installing the plugs in the engine, simply use a pair of side cutter pliers to provide a light crimp).

 

I have found that you can place the tip of the crimped end cap in a vise and use a 13/16" wrench to unscrew the spark plug. Of course the underlying threads at the tips of the spark plug get a bit mangled, but that is no matter because the wire clips of the OE spark plug wire connectors will grip them all the same.

[Mike Self]

6 hours ago, its55 said:

discovered that my plug size appears to be a Bosch W225T2 which, from what I can tell via searching, is a plug for an Alfa Romeo?

That W225T2 was so designated under the old Bosch plug numbering system which hasn't been used for something like 15-20 years, so you have some vintage plugs.  I'm sure if you go on line you can find a chart that lists old and new Bosch numbers.  

 

According to my 1975 Bosch catalog, a carbureted 2002 should use a W200T30 spark plug; back in the day I always ran a W175T30.  What I don't remember is whether the heat range ran hotter with higher numbers (i.e. a W200 plug was a hotter plug than a W175), nor do I remember what the modern Bosch plug number equivalent is. 

 

However, second the motion on NGK plugs vs Bosch.  Some years ago I put a set of new Bosch plugs in my Nissan truck just before a trip and was plagued by a persistent, eratic misfire;  swapped the nearly new Bosch plugs for NGKs, and the miss disappeared.  Have been using NGKs ever since.   

 

mike

[OriginalOwner]

I've always used Champion N9Y.  

 

Here's the page of the Owner's Manual .......

 

 

 

Cheers,

 

Carl

 

[bergie33]

Here is another thread on the subject of spark plugs:  

I found some Denso W20EP plugs on Ebay last year and grabbed a few sets, so there is another option.

 

[bergie33]

Here are some Denso plugs in eBay now:

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/224237622003?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=7jJ3MEBLSpC&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=LbO37BJ3Rw-&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

 

[its55]

Thank you all for your replies, I greatly appreciate!  

 

RockAuto has the Champion N9Y's, I'll probably just go w/ those after reading all this.

Edited June 23, 2022 by its55

[John76]

12 hours ago, Mike Self said:

I don't remember is whether the heat range ran hotter with higher numbers

Heat range numbers vary with the make and not always in the same way.

 

NGK - lower number = hotter

Bosch - higher number = hotter

Champion - higher number = hotter

Denso - lower number = hotter

[its55]

33 minutes ago, John76 said:

Heat range numbers vary with the make and not always in the same way.

 

NGK - lower number = hotter

Bosch - higher number = hotter

Champion - higher number = hotter

Denso - lower number = hotter

 

Yes, and I found this chart ...

 

 

[popovm]

15 hours ago, cda951 said:

 

Are there NGK plugs where the end caps are not removable at all? All the recent ones I have used have screw on end caps, but they are then crimped on at the factory (this is what everyone here with aftermarket wires which require end caps  should be doing with these caps before installing the plugs in the engine, simply use a pair of side cutter pliers to provide a light crimp).

 

I have found that you can place the tip of the crimped end cap in a vise and use a 13/16" wrench to unscrew the spark plug. Of course the underlying threads at the tips of the spark plug get a bit mangled, but that is no matter because the wire clips of the OE spark plug wire connectors will grip them all the same.

 

Yup, learned this the hard way but only after I destroyed a plug trying to unscrew an unscrewable end cap. Not my proudest moment! 

[popovm]

15 hours ago, OriginalOwner said:

I've always used Champion N9Y.  

 

Here's the page of the Owner's Manual .......

 

 

 

Cheers,

 

Carl

 

 

I also am using these Champions. Easily available at most parts stores and cheap. I am pretty happy with them. I got fed up trying to find non-R NGKs and took a flyer on these. I don't see any downside. 

[its55]

A little update here.  Pulled the remaining plugs yesterday.  Plugs 1 and 2 are the aforementioned W225T2.  Plugs 3 and 4 are the spec'd W200T30!  I wonder how old all these plugs are?  I guess the previous owner just used what he found ?.  I can locate any information about these old Bosch numbers, I sure would like to know more about these plugs.  Anyway, while I wait on the new Champions I've properly gapped (one was correct) the plugs and reinstalled them for now.  We'll see how he runs today.

Edited June 24, 2022 by its55