engine and drivetrain Why don't we see more M42s in 2002s?

[nevadainMN]

This is a doable swap right?

I know the S14 is the hot ticket for 02 swaps, but the S14 is an expensive, high maintenance engine. I know, I owned one. And if you break something they cost huge dollars to fix. Plus they aren't all that easy to come by. It's a great swap for a lightly driven or track car, but not what I would choose to put serious miles on.

The M42 however, except for the profile gasket problem on the early ones, is fairly robust and turns out just shy of 150hp with a performance chip, weighs only about 50lbs more than an M10 and can be had for a few hundred dollars. (I just bought a 95 M42 complete with all accessories, intact wiring harness, Dinan chip and lightweight flywheel for $250, although its destined for an e30 project not an '02.)

It seems like a good way to get a big jump in horsepower in an engine package that is everyday driveable.

I'm no mechanic so if I have to go out and buy or have built a 150hp M10 I assume it will cost me at least $3,000-$4.000 and not be nearly as everday reliable.

Plus for that investment I could slap a Downing Atlanta Supercharger on my M42 and be turning out S14 Horsepower without the expense of maintaining the S14.

So other than the unfair (IMHO), bad wrap the M42 has gotten, is there some other reason we don't see more of these in '02s?

[KFunk]

The M42 has no bottom-end torque. I've driven my friend's 91 318iS, and it feels really, really weak at the bottom end. He's driven my car when it had the 32/36, and agrees. Sure the M42 sings at the top end, but my tired M10 is more fun, even with a 32/36. Now that I've got DCOEs, there's no comparison.

Probably a personal preference thing, but I prefer the bottom end torque to break the rear tires loose and spin the rear-end exactly where I want it. It's just a good feeling.

If you simply want higher horsepower numbers, then yeah, looks nice on paper, and might win in a drag race. But the 16V system has too much extra crap to spin up at lower RPMs, where the extra valves don't really help performance, but simply rob torque.

I have no idea how an S14 feels though, never driven one.

[ash00]

I was thinking the same thing.. its a wonderful motor- but I guess its taller than the M10 right? I had three motors for my 318is: 1 being a dud, the other from a 95, and the one thats currently in the car (timing chain and water pump, but 227K on the ticker). If I didn't put the 95 in the car, I'd love to do an m42 swap into an 02. I think it would scream!

I'm sure someone has done this right?

[_z_]

if you do a search for m42 ( http://www.bmw2002faq.com/component/option,com_forum/Itemid,57/page,search/ ) you'll find a lot of discussion.

here is another page

http://www.francisscott.com/~bmw2002/gallery/don.htm

to quote

Sooo.. what'd we change for this engine swap?

-fabricate. motor mounts

-fab. trans mount

-fab. shifter platform

-cut, weld, rebalance driveshaft

-move battery to trunk

-install pump in gas tank, and second pump in engine compartment, and

change fuel lines

-remove brake booster, fab. new pedal box with remote booster

-replace 95 computer with 94 so we didn't need to deal with the anti-theft system on the 95

-fab. throttle linkage to cable throttle

-Change oil pan/pickup to clear the steering gear -modify steering gear

-fab custom exhaust

-modify the serpentine belt and pulleys to eliminate the power steering pump

-install a large, expensive, crossflow radiator w/required overflow tank

-make a hybrid transmission up that will have a speedo drive (the 318ti got

it's drive from the diff. -Cut out the entire floor pan and tunnel, and install a larger one from a 320i to clear the new larger transmission.

-fab a custom wiring harness and locate the computer under the dash

-recalibrate speedo to read accurately at a different cable rotational speed

-cut a hole in the front bulkhead for the protruding K&N air filter. The stock AF was not going to fit... not anywhere near that intake...

and probably some stuff I have (mercifully) forgotten....

So some fairly substantial modifications must be made to make the engine fit.

while the s14 mostly drops in right?

-z

[Harv]

Do you have to use a 323 4 or 5 speed on that motor?

I got the feeling that it's 2 cylinders cut off an E36 6 cylinder. Is the oil pan tricky?

I like the motor too. Got to dump that stupid duel mass flywheel and it really comes alive.

Isn't Skipster doing one of these?

John

[ash00]

no one has responded on the e30 forums, but will a m20 flywheel work on an M42? Will it still accept a stock m42 clutch? does it need a m20 starter pinion?

[BLUNT]

This is a doable swap right?

I know the S14 is the hot ticket for 02 swaps, but the S14 is an expensive, high maintenance engine. I know, I owned one. And if you break something they cost huge dollars to fix. Plus they aren't all that easy to come by. It's a great swap for a lightly driven or track car, but not what I would choose to put serious miles on.

The M42 however, except for the profile gasket problem on the early ones, is fairly robust and turns out just shy of 150hp with a performance chip, weighs only about 50lbs more than an M10 and can be had for a few hundred dollars. (I just bought a 95 M42 complete with all accessories, intact wiring harness, Dinan chip and lightweight flywheel for $250, although its destined for an e30 project not an '02.)

It seems like a good way to get a big jump in horsepower in an engine package that is everyday driveable.

I'm no mechanic so if I have to go out and buy or have built a 150hp M10 I assume it will cost me at least $3,000-$4.000 and not be nearly as everday reliable.

Plus for that investment I could slap a Downing Atlanta Supercharger on my M42 and be turning out S14 Horsepower without the expense of maintaining the S14.

So other than the unfair (IMHO), bad wrap the M42 has gotten, is there some other reason we don't see more of these in '02s?

i dunno tony, s14's can be had pretty reasonably if you buy from the right guy

[02again]

I think you'll find the M42 out of the 1991 318IS (E30) has a more swap friendly engine. The pan fits...I'm pretty sure. I think we should all get together and design up parts needed to do the swap. I had a 91 318is for a while and it was really a Lot of fun. (and car still a daily driver)

[Guest]

This is easy. I own both. My 1600 has a 2.0L engine and my 1991 318is has the M42. My 1600 is fast than the 318is.

[febi_guibo]

i am working on this swap (very very slowly) ...the big issues so far are the steering box and exhaust manifold...

re comparisons to M10, M20, S14 engines, it's kind of an acquired taste...

but you get very easy maintenance, free revving, and low cost long blocks with lots of parts always around. A lightened m20 flywheel with the m42 starter ring is a nice mod, and folks are working up some neat projects ranging from megasquirt w/ITBs, turbos, and strokers using the m47 diesel crank. The DA supercharger has been fitted to the E30 M42 with just a few tweaks.

I guess my point is that the potential of the engine is being pushed along and there are some nice pluses...

It made sense for me primarily because I know the engine well, have sunk a ton of money into my M42 already, have a zillion E30 parts, and lets face it, the power to weight ratio of putting it a 2002 makes too much sense! well, maybe not quite...

really, the question is.... uh, why don't we see more rack and pinion conversions in 2002s?

in all seriousness... anyone else working on this swap... please chime in... i would love to hear from you!

[ingraham]

I'm going to stick my neck out and claim that the conversion takes 50-100 hours of labor. Around here that labor costs $5k-$10K. (You could buy a couple of nice E30s for that.)

Instead of going to all that trouble, you could spend $5k and get a tii engine up to about 150 hp.

[bingbong]

engine swaps will always be more unless its a straight away drop in, which is highly unlikely. best way to get more Hp out of the car new carbies, better flow exhaust and cam also prob a lighter flywheel and 5 speed box.

[Gordon]

This discussion has been beaten to death the last few years, go do a search on M42 in the forum search engine or do a search in the old archives. Bottom line, the conversion from M10 to M42 is a pain in the ass, a lot of fabrication has to be done to make it work. I know Pierre did a lot of research on it and decided it was easier to do a M20 swap into a 02.

Stay tuned, I've heard rumors of 2002 Haus is in the R&D stage of creating some fabricated parts that will make it easier to drop the M42 into an 02. When Rob is ready, I'm sure he'll let everyone know. It make take a while, Rob doesn't do anything half ass. It will be a quality product and throughly tested.

http://www.bmw2002faq.com/component/option,com_forum/Itemid,57/page,viewtopic/t,285761/highlight,pierre/

http://www.bmw2002faq.com/component/option,com_forum/Itemid,57/page,viewtopic/t,289126/highlight,pierre/

There are countless other articles related to M42 swap if you go search for them.

G-Man

[dapbmw]

the 1.8 liter makes more HP than the m42/44 1.8 DOHC. and is 3 kg lighter than an m10, Dbilas sells a nice ITB setup and camshafts for it too. Unfortunately they were never available in NA but there were a few cars imported with that motor here.

M40

SOHC 8V. Replaced the M10.

1987-1993. 81kg 178lbs

Used on: 87 E30 316i/318i, E34 518i, Pre 93 E36 316i

Power: 1.6 (102bhp), 1.8 (122bhp)

it looks like the same block as an m10?

http://www.maxbimmer.pl/artykuly/img/e30-silnik-m40.jpg

i'm pretty sure this will be easier than the m42 as it is smaller?

[JimSlay]

having driven an 02 with an m42 i will tell you its a great conversion. this car had an e30 steering column and an e21 steering rack so thi sub frame was buchard and i dont remember if the engine fits with a stock steering set up "just something to concider". this car ended up getting smashed up awhile ago but i would urge any body to do the conversion, it will be worth the work when you are done.