control arm bushing install problem...

[vintage_car]

the problem is I can't get them installed! I have looked at Bill's writeup on them...

http://www.bmw2002faq.com/component/option,com_forum/Itemid,50/page,viewtopic/t,283064/highlight,/

the bailing wire is what is throwing me off. What is it for? Does it prevent the bushing from squishing outward when trying to draw it into the hole?

When I tried a long bolt with a washers and tried to pull the bushing through the bushing just squished, it never drew into the hole... should I put the bushing in a sleeve or something? hints, ideas, anything![/u]

[jerry]

the bailing wire acts to prevent the rubber from merely squishing/bulging out. think of it like a girdle. you absolutely should use glycerine or soap as a lubricant. just swab it on the ID of the control arm and on the leading edge of the bushing. as the bushing is forced into the hole you'll have to gradually pull the wire off (or you'll merely entrap the wire into the bushing).

also, it is important to get a spacer (i used an old bushing) to apply the clamping force against the center bore only. you'll need to push it beyond the 'final position' to seat the forward lip into place.

i recently purchased some hardened ACME threaded rod from McMaster-Carr to replace the all-thread available at most hardware stores. i added a thrustwasher to help in turning the nut and put some anti-seize on the threads. that setup will pull a bushing through a pinhole now....

i'll update the post with photos in the near future as it really is a worthwhile upgrade if you are doing more than just a couple control arms.

[BLUNT]

youre not trying to install the outers where the inners go or vice versa are you?

I cant recall offhand but one set is slightly larger in diameter

[02Les]

Getting them in is the (relatively) easy part. Getting mine out was the deal. I then found the internal diameter, after I cleaned out the remains, left a lot to be desired. There were bumps inside, which didn't help the new bushings going in.

If I have to replace anymore, I will take the expensive route next time, and get new control arms complete with the bushings fitted.

[nbcbird]

Try using silicone spray or a little silicone grease as a lubricant--it works wonders with rubber bushings.--Jim

[socal73]

If you find a solution let me know...I have been working on mine for 3 days now. Made the pipe system, tried the wire, tried 3 types of lube, tried a pvc contraption. At this point the bushing is getting deformed. And my wife wants to know why i'm in a bad mood.

[vintage_car]

the bailing wire acts to prevent the rubber from merely squishing/bulging out. think of it like a girdle. you absolutely should use glycerine or soap as a lubricant. just swab it on the ID of the control arm and on the leading edge of the bushing. as the bushing is forced into the hole you'll have to gradually pull the wire off (or you'll merely entrap the wire into the bushing).

also, it is important to get a spacer (i used an old bushing) to apply the clamping force against the center bore only. you'll need to push it beyond the 'final position' to seat the forward lip into place.

i recently purchased some hardened ACME threaded rod from McMaster-Carr to replace the all-thread available at most hardware stores. i added a thrustwasher to help in turning the nut and put some anti-seize on the threads. that setup will pull a bushing through a pinhole now....

i'll update the post with photos in the near future as it really is a worthwhile upgrade if you are doing more than just a couple control arms.

When I wrap the bailing wire it doesn't stay tight enough. I'm using 18ga. I do have the old bushings metal tubes that were in the old bushings. So I need to put that on one end, run a washer over the top of it, then a bolt long enough to go thru the center of the new bushing the control arm and out the other side. On the other side of the control arm a washer large enough to span the hole and a nut to wrench on... this should pull the bushing thru with some lubricant on it. The only thing different in that scenario that I didn;t do was the old bushings metal tube. I just had a flat washer on top of the new bushing. This just made the bushing squeeze up.

BLUNT- I double- rechecked the bushing locations and they are in the right holes, but at first That is what I thought I was doing since they look very similar. Instead of using bailing wire, what if I put a piece of pvc around the bushing to prevent it from squeezing outwards?

To remove the old bushing I just burned them out, it was simple enough.

[jerry]

When I wrap the bailing wire it doesn't stay tight enough. I'm using 18ga.

.....So I need to put that on one end, run a washer over the top of it, then a bolt long enough to go thru the center of the new bushing the control arm and out the other side. On the other side of the control arm a washer large enough to span the hole and a nut to wrench on... this should pull the bushing thru with some lubricant on it.

...... Instead of using bailing wire, what if I put a piece of pvc around the bushing to prevent it from squeezing outwards?

To remove the old bushing I just burned them out, it was simple enough.

my original photo does not adequately show that i leave about 3 inches of bailing wire at the start of the wrap to use to grab onto, and another 3 inch length at the end of the wrap. then to keep it from unwinding while i set up the system i merely give the two ends a half-twist around each other. you should be using the type of wire that is made for tying re-bar together; do not use hi-tensile strength wire like piano wire!!!

you'll need to use either the PVC tube or the pipe-fitting tube as shown in the original post because, you need to draw the bushing past its final position to set the lip in place. the way i understand your description, you'll be able to pull the bushing up to the point of contact with the large washer you are using...

as for the use of a PVC girdle, i suppose you could cut a fitting in half, lube the ID and wire it closed with your bushing inside. don't know if there's an off-the-shelf size available, so a little modification might be needed.

try it and let us know....

using silicon grease is a good alternative to glycerine to lube the rubber, don't, however, use a petroleum-based grease on the rubber.

adding anti-seize to the bolt threads, i found, helped. so did the addition of a thrust washer.

[vintage_car]

The old metal tube from the old bushing, using that as the main pressure point on the new bushing as it is bein pulled through, wont just push the metal tube out of the new bushing?

What does petroleum based lubricant do to a bushing, curious...

[jerry]

The old metal tube from the old bushing, using that as the main pressure point on the new bushing as it is bein pulled through, wont just push the metal tube out of the new bushing?

What does petroleum based lubricant do to a bushing, curious...

the rubber sticks amazingly tenaciously to the metal sleeve. Just try to peel it off a used bushing.

petroleum-based grease will potentially degrade the rubber over time; synthetic rubbers are oil-based. real rubber is derived from a plant, a milky sap from a tropical plant, rubber tree if i recall.

[vintage_car]

So below is my setup. Wire wrapped around the center of the bushing. I chopped one of the metal tubes from the old bushing in half, washer on top of it. Bottom of control arm is 2 washers large enough to span the hole of the control arm with a nut that I am turning to push the bushing through. Used silicon spray on bushing edge and control arm hole. The leading edge of the bushing still squishes out as I am tightening the bolt. I tried pvc tube and that didn't work it allowed for expansion enough in the pvc tube that it was ineffective. Any other ideas?

[vintage_car]

You can see the edge squished out.

(nt)

[jerry]

looking at your photo, it appears that you are using a thinner gauge wire to wrap the bushing. additionally, i suggest that you put more windings on the bushing. it looks like the forward side is not adequately wrapped. you are starting the process with the bushing bulging at the onset. i think your wire is too thin. i suppose you can use it, but you'll have to wind your bushing more. compare with the wire i used in the original photo of a year or two ago referred to in the OP.

put some grease on your threads to help turn the nut otherwise you risk galling the threads and nut. you WILL be exerting a large load on that bolt.

one more comment: i bought some bushings from AutohausAZ and they turned out to be the wrong bushings. they were too large, probably for a 320i or some such. just a possibility. i still have those damn things. i waited too long to install them and lost the receipt.

[vintage_car]

The outer bushings were bought from autohausaz for me as a gift for christmas... I purchased the inner ones from blunt just the other day. Just as confirmation... outer bushing is closest to ball joint.

The package labelled for the autohausaz outer bushings is 31121112902

I will get more wire around it and a thicker gauge...if that doesn't work it is off to a shop with a hydraulic press.

[NickVyse]

To remove the old bushing I just burned them out, it was simple enough.

Make sure you didn't over heat the sleeve on the control arm and deform it - if so you'll never get them in and will need new arms.